The Happiness Quotient

Is Everest Dying? Fighter Jets Over the Summit? - A Conversation with Everest Chronicler, Podcaster and Mountaineer Alan Arnette

July 21, 2022 Thom Pollard Episode 106
The Happiness Quotient
Is Everest Dying? Fighter Jets Over the Summit? - A Conversation with Everest Chronicler, Podcaster and Mountaineer Alan Arnette
Show Notes Transcript

Thom Pollard sat down with Everest Chronicler Alan Arnette to talk about all things Everest. In this first of a several part episode with Alan, we talk about all the current state of affairs on Everest, and what the future looks like for Everest. Is climate change changing the game on 8,000 meter peaks?

Visit Thom's YouTube channel for this conversation with Alan Arnette as well as a bunch of other Everest-related material:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEk3e_XGyNnqwK2ZlxH7fEA

Alan Arnette's website: https://www.alanarnette.com/
Alan's YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/AlanArnetteClimbs 

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Thom Pollard:

The following is a conversation with Alan R net. Alan is a coach, a keynote speaker, a mountaineer and an Alzheimer's advocate. He summited Everest in 2001 and became the oldest American to summit k two at the age of 58. On his birthday, July 27 2014, Alan has been cited as one of the world's most respected chroniclers of Everest by Outside Magazine. Summit coach his ongoing company is a consulting service that helps aspiring climbers throughout the world achieve their goals. His blog and website at Alan arnette.com is a must see for anyone interested in anything Everest or the 8000 meter peaks and beyond. I've used that website, blog and research area countless times when in need of stats or updates on recent events. He has a podcast on his website as well as a YouTube page. I asked Alan about Everest, the state of Everest, is it being degraded by too many people going there by too many firsts? Too many people trying to do things differently there. His answer is plain and honest. But in true Allen style, he ends it on a positive and hopeful note. He also speaks about the climate crisis confronting us and the future of climbing. If you haven't already, please take a moment to subscribe to this channel. Comment and like this video, let me know what you think. Thank you. You're the you're where people go for information. you've logged information, facts and figures, how many? How many bodies are on Everest? How many summits? Have there been? How many multiple summits have there been? And that's saying something because you're you're a source for people to learn the information in the facts they know. But you also have that emotional component.

Alan Arnette:

Yeah, I mean, first off, you know, give all credit to the Himalayan database. And, you know, the late Elizabeth Holly and Billy barreling the whole, Richard Salaberry, that whole group that just does yeoman's work and cataloging at least in Nepal than in the, in the Tibet 8000 hours and other mountains. So, you know, there really, were I get a lot of the that raw data. But to your point, I also think that there's more to climbing than just numbers, and there's more to climbing than just standing on top of a summit, you know, beating your chest declaring victory and going home and telling people Yeah, I summited Everest, I was all by myself, by the way, I didn't use boots, you know, I, I went up a route that's never been climbed before. And I carried all of my gear in from India, you know, people exaggerate so much these days on social media that is really, I think, diluting the integrity of the sport. So what I have tried to do from the very beginning, when I first started my website, Alan arnette.com, pretty original, but easy to remember, some guy told me, I should change the name because it's hard to spell. And nobody knows who Alan Arnette is. So I'll keep going with this path. I started in 1999, as a family website, and I quickly saw the dark side of the Internet where people were stealing pictures of our daughter and things like that. So I changed over to just chronicling my climbs, and then being very authentic and transparent. So you know, if I tried to climb a mountain, whether it was a 14, or a Shishapangma, or whatever, and I gave up or I threw up, or I fell down, or whatever, I just told it like it was so I think that I began to develop a reputation for being just, you know, just telling it like it is. And you know what, I wasn't trying to convince anybody of anything, and I'm not to this day, I'm just trying to give information, share my personal experiences, and inviting people to take from that tease from that whatever they want. And I think that that, that emotion as you as you noted earlier, is part of what I helped bring to people that they understand that climbing is not a mechanical act, it is a whole essence is your mind is your body. It's your spirit is your soul. You know, it is mental toughness is physical, the ante to be strong enough physically, but mostly it comes down to, you know, just can you manage your emotions going through the process, in the worst of times, in the best of times, in order to tease the best out of that experience. And to come home what I consider to be a better version of yourself because you've learned through going through that suffering and that's where the emotion comes from.

Thom Pollard:

Hey, Alan, let me ask you real quick and now that we kind of got the emotionalLenin spiritual part, talked about a little bit. What is the future of Everest? And where's it going? And and in that question, have things gone too far Are there too many people trying to be the first to be a person to climb it with this certain ailment or lack of certain limb or something like that, and not to diminish one iota. That but it, it's kind of getting a little bit overrun. And I think that as an inside guy, even it, it's tiring a little bit to see. So So what is the state of of Everest as we know it, and let's maybe take Nepal because China does things a little differently, keeps it a little bit cleaner over there literally and figuratively. So where are we at?

Alan Arnette:

Yeah, I mean, it's a complicated question. And I think that people like you and me have to be very careful not to be judgmental, on or to be the Get off my lawn Old man, you know, that back end my day? You know, I think we have to be careful about that. And I think we have to be honest and candid about the state of affairs. What we're seeing these days on Everest in this guy's humble opinion, is that we're seeing way too many people that are being seduced by clever marketing, primarily from the large Nepali companies that could say, you know, you don't need to spend 65 $75,000, you can do it for 30 35,000 25,000. And you don't need a lot of experience, because we will teach you everything you need to know on the mountain. And so sadly, there's a lot of Indian national, special young Indian nationals that are falling for that line. And I talked about this a lot after the 2019 season. And I spoke with a lot of people in India, from very respected climbers to journalist, just your everyday person. And I kept hearing the same thing that in India, there is this cultural phenomenon that if you go to Everest and you summit, I mean, you're, you're a hero, you come home, and you are rewarded with cash and land. I don't know of any other country that does that. There's, there's some stuff in Pakistan, but India really excels. And if you die on Everest, you become a martyr for the rest of your life. And then your family celebrates your martyrdom for centuries. So there's this strange phenomenon going on that said, this year, we saw multiple people from India submit multiple 8000 meter mountains, which leads me to a broader point that the style of which Everest is being climbed today, and the other 8000 meter mountains. And sadly, even k two has dramatically changed from what it was even even five years ago, grew dramatically from 10 or 15 years ago, and astronomically from what a, you know, people were doing with national teams back in the 70s 80s and 90s. These days, you sign up with a team, you know, the Sherpas go, they plow the route to the summit. And this applies to almost every single one of the biggest mountains in the world, including even Aachen Congo, where they're starting to use supplemental oxygen. And so the surplus they put into fixed lines, they put it in the camps, they stock it with food, fuel, oxygen, the clients typically stay at Basecamp. Maybe they do one rotation, which instead of the three that traditionally people like you and I have done, or even for, sometimes they'll acclimatized on a low mache or an island peak, you know, to get to 20,000 feet, but then when everything's all ready, and there's a good weather forecast, you know, they go they clip into the fixed ropes and off they go, they start using oxygen now well below 7000 meters, which below at Camp three was the line of demarcation. Now you start using it at a camp to and some even a camp one at running at four to six, and in some situations, even up to eight litres per minute. So all of a sudden, all of the things that cause climbing these big mountains to become a very physical and mental challenge, and a tested you to your core, slowly but surely, the teams are just mitigating all of those challenges, and we're seeing more and more people Summit. And you know what, I'm I'm thrilled to death for him because I think you know, I always say that whatever your reason is, is unique and personal to you. And, you know, go celebrate, go to your Summit, go home, but also be candid, be transparent about the style in which you summited and you know, there are there's two groups in my mind, there's recreational climbers, and then there's professional climbers slash record seekers If you're a recreational climber, I don't give a rat's ass you know, when you started using oxygen, if you're a professional sponsored, being paid, or you're trying to set a record or claim Sup, you're trying to set something that you claimed no one else has ever done. And you're not playing by the same rules as your predecessors. Shame on you.

Thom Pollard:

Yeah, right. I completely agree. Alan, also, one thing that I noticed, particularly in 2016, it was starting to show itself in 2014. But 2016 was the last time I was in on the Nepal side.A lot of the people who die are those, if you will, who take the hook, line a nd sinker for the low budget climbing expedition. So while the outside world might scorn at someone paying $100,000 for a one on one, Western guide, I say that not to diminish any of the Eastern climbers but but let's just say an American guide, those people aren't dying. As if anything, those the people paying more money are living because of the experience level. And so in terms of the low budget expedition companies, they're hiring Sherpa, who many of whom I've encountered directly, who have almost no experience at all. And not only that, don't know how to handle an adult man who says, I'm going to the summit, you're gonna have to fight me for it. Okay, I quit. So these people are dying at on, you know, at higher rates, because of that

Alan Arnette:

A case, a case in point was the young Sherpa who was literally a trekking Porter that got, he got sick, and he got drafted to the guy this Pakistani general from the Pakistani military. This kid was 18. He was in his 60s, and he gave up all the Sherpa gave up all of his oxygen, they summited within a collapse coming down. And thankfully, some really strong super Sherpas saved their lives. And the young Sherpa lost both hands amputated, the Pakistani general went back home and said that the Sherpa almost killed him. But look, I summited so there. I mean, that's an exception, you know, but it's, but it's also illustrative of the dynamics going on. You know, I kind of look at every Stover over the years and kind of phases, you know, back into where there was, you know, the national teams, the British, the Swiss, the Americans, Italians went in, you know, those were the national teams, that's when if one person submitted the whole team was a success. Then you had commercialization start with, you know, haul and ball and Carrie Kobler. And Russell Bryce and Eric Simonson and, you know, that whole group back in the early 90s, and that progressed. And then around 2013, primarily coincident with the disaster a man is Lou, the Sherpas began to see that they were just a skill because they've been climbing with those restaurant companies for 20 some odd years. And then true enough. I mean, they had 1015 summits of Everest, and from a climbing perspective from knowing adverse, they were golden and are golden. They perhaps lack the skills to turn around and adult man or to recognize AMS as early then turn them around, you know, so medical, perhaps wasn't their cultural language. But that progressed then from 2013 to almost 10 years later now. And so we saw, you know, companies do Nepali companies just explode. And it went from 80% of the summit in 2000. Let's say 10, being guided by Western companies, Australian, German, you know, British American, to eight to 80%. Today, getting to the summit with Nepali companies only 20% by that old guard. So it is completely flip flopped. And now we're seeing this bifurcation amongst the Nepali guides. Now, they are starting to play the airline game of you know, United Airlines versus Jet Blue, competing on price and service. So now you've got these high end Nepali guides, which are absolutely legitimately asking $65,000 per client in meanwhile, you still got Nepali companies that are happy sitting at that 30 providing a base level of service. So you know, I guess the good news is just like you know, JetBlue opened up an entire market Ryanair for people to go see their relatives, you know, not have to spend a fortune flying on airplanes. Now they've opened up a new market so that people can go climb in the Himalaya and not spend a fortune, but in some cases has come at this price of safety. And when I talk to some of the Nepali guys, not all of them by any stretch of the imagination, there are some great Nepali only companies out there that I would send my family with in a second. But there are some that say, it's not our job to turn around a client, our job is to get them on the mountain, and they can do whatever they want to, and if they die, not our problem. So but you've also got some Western companies that have kind of had that same attitude. And I obviously not going to name names. But over the years, we've had some Western companies with that same type of attitude. I think, however, that's pretty negative. But I think however, looking forward, I think the industry is kind of cleaning up his act relative to safety, mainly through the advancement of technology, weather forecasting, oxygen delivery systems, just you know, the gear itself, the quality of the gear, and the Sherpas. And now through mainly efforts like through the Khumbu Climbing Center are becoming much more skilled, their their interpersonal communications have vastly improved. And they're, you know, this their, their medical knowledge is also improving. And now we're seeing, you know, people with 2025 summits of Everest, and they're as good as any Western guide out there. So, you know, the world is changing, is absolutely evolving. And I think as long as more people are able to enjoy the mountains and do it in a respectful way, Leave No Trace, other elements like that. And I say, you know, let's enjoy our planet. But let's be respectful of it.

Thom Pollard:

Alan, your knowledge of Everest is vast, and people seek you out for the factual information about it. But emotionally, not just Everest, but all the big mountains of the world. But emotionally and intellectually, you have a deep tie to it. And I would love for you to share with me what we were just talking about before the record button was hit. You actually got a somewhat of a late start in the game for high altitude mountaineering as my cat makes an appearance.

Alan Arnette:

I love him.

Thom Pollard:

That's Simba. He is in dire need of attention. But yeah, tell me a little bit about that. Because it's fascinating to get started. No, I was 27. And I thought I was late to the game.

Alan Arnette:

Yeah, you know, I've got this consulting business where I help people get into mountaineering called summit coach. And one of the questions I often get are from people that are like 18. And they say, you know, Alan, I want to go climb Mount Everest, I don't have any money or any experience. And oh, by the way, I want to do it next year. Or, or I get the other end of the spectrum, I've got a 72 year old client with a 69 year old girlfriend, and they want to go to do the seven summits in one year. And they he she's on Kilimanjaro, and that's about it. But I also get the people in the middle that are in their early 40s. And you know, they're successful in life successful in personal relationships, but they've reached a point where they want to do something for themselves. And Tom, I've always believed that, at least for me that my life is an equal lateral triangle. And that all three sides when I never made it, I didn't I've never successful in doing this, but his work family in me, and trying to keep that triangle balanced in has been situational, you know, throughout my entire life as I struggled to get that balance. But the so when I began, you know, I got an electrical engineering degree from the University of Memphis in 1979, that'll date me. And, but I knew I was never going to be a good engineer. But I knew I had good communication skills. And I could process a lot of information and kind of distill it down to what are the salient facts? So I went into sales with Hewlett Packard. And I did that in Dallas for about eight years that I moved here to Fort Collins, Colorado, in the late 80s. And eventually over to Europe, and in the late 90s. But that whole first round of 1520 years of my career, I was heads down, workaholic, you know, work family, no, nothing for me, nothing for family all work. And, you know, and I was successful, but it came at a cost. And so I was in Geneva, Switzerland running this really big organization. And I've told this story before, but so, you know, I had several 1000 employees, half a billion dollars in revenue, profit loss. And so my financial person came in Marielle, from France. And so she came in late July and she's gone. I will see you in September, and I have no idea where these accidents come from. So and so I said, September, Muriel, what are you talking about? What happened to what happened August and she goes, Oh, yes, that's right. You're an American. You don't have any idea about living your life. All you know how to do is to work. I'm French. We take off the month we go to the beach, we go to the mountains, we're with family, we drink wine, we eat cheese, we get to know each other. We renew we relax and then I come back and I work hard again for you. But I she turned around and walked away.

Thom Pollard:

Wow

Alan Arnette:

you know and I began to think about that, and I thought, You know what she is exactly spot on. I mean, you know, my career was going well, everything was going well on that one leg of the triangle. But so that I decided that, you know, I'd done a couple of 14,000 foot mountains here in Colorado. And I could look out my window in Geneva and see Mont Blanc. So I hired a French Gulf age to take me up. And this guy, you know, he must have thought I was like, Where'd this guy come from, you know, but I fell in love with the whole atmosphere of climbing the crush of the crampons in the snow, seeing the sun rise from the summit, you know, the coal, I just fell in love with the time just fell in love with it. So I then did a trek to Everest base camp. And I saw the majesty of the Himalayas and in the, you know, Buddhism, and the Sherpas and old lady spitting prayer wheels, and the little kids playing with sticks, happy as a clam. And you know, I just realized that, you know, there's a lot more to this planet, into our existence in it in our ability to make a contribution than just get heads down, just working all the time. And that was an inflection point in my life. And it started at age 38.

Thom Pollard:

That's absolutely fascinating. So you, you really did make a difference. And as a person who starts at 38, you'd figure to tag Everest would be enough. Oh, but you've done now. 38 some odd expeditions que tu is that, to me is like doing Everest five times and at the age of 58. However, you knock that one off, that's that's actually something that's a whole side note, I think that we can talk about some days. So kind of trying to put a little bit of a bow and a ribbon on it real quick. Let me just ask if you're talking about Leave No Trace. About a year and a half ago, I did a symposium if you will on the garbage crisis and the human waste crisis on Everest. D, it seems to me that a lot of the problem are people trying to get away with dumping garbage and human waste and getting by all the rules and regulations put in place. Do you have any thoughts on that and what might be the best way to keep the mountain clean moving forward?

Alan Arnette:

You know, it's inexcusable to me we have we have role models and case studies around the world. Aachen Cago used to be just a, you know, just a poop pile. You know, Denali, National Park Service has done a great job there. But even then, they would take the so called Clean mountain cans, which you know, you poop in a bag, they would then take those bags on the way down and throw them into a crevasse. And so now, studies are showing the groundwater to being polluted in the general area of Denali. So they're stopped that practice, you know, so you know, stuff we go, duh, you know, that we're now finally learning how to do it. You know, Elbrus is still just horrible, just horrible. Kilimanjaro, and you know, they've got toilets on it. But it also is pretty bad. Everest, you know, the Chinese have done to your point, opening it up, they've done a fairly decent job of understanding that, you know, if you destroy your mountain, then you're gonna destroy a cash cow doesn't hurt that they're building this huge Mountaineering Museum and Tingri, you know, in order to attract people on a high speed train from Beijing, you know, to turn to turn in Everest on Northside into Disneyland. You know, what, you know, when they're, when they're cleaning up the mountain? That's the that's the, that's the senior point, Nepal, plenty of opportunity for improvement. You know, I was talking to one Nepali company, I said, Why don't you use blue bags, WAG bags, you know, basically the plastic bag that you poop in? And then have your clients bring it down? They said, Oh, no, that's $1 a bag and you don't have any bags with us. So raise your price by $50. I don't know a single climber in the world that wouldn't pay an extra 50 bucks to keep the mountain clean. And, you know, the lower camps are getting better and better. But the high camp I like it, the South Col is just, you know, the problem is that I remember being there. And I asked him, you know, we're going to go, you know, do a number two, and the guy goes anywhere, really, you know, and, you know, and so you walk around and you see just these little turds frozen into the ground, because there's only a third of the oxygen. It doesn't disintegrate, doesn't deteriorate. And the wind is not strong enough even though it's 150 miles an hour because it's frozen into the ground. So you've got this, you know, this turd field at the South Pole, which is disgusting.

Thom Pollard:

Yeah, so So that's the garbage thing. Allen, tell me about about you. Do you have any future plans? Are you going to go back climbing or are you more of a summit coach because because summit coaching is a part of your Business, what what ambitions do you have for the future in terms of mountaineering?

Alan Arnette:

You know, I think my I, I'm, I can say with 99.9% certainty, my 8000 meter days are over, you know, it's July, this is July 12, and 15th date, I turned 66. I just went on Medicare last year, dammit, you know, so you know, and but I have been incredibly lucky. I mentioned this before we started recording that, you know, I was born and raised in Memphis, Tennessee, at elevation 318. And to have climbed the mountains I have, the only word I have is gratitude. And I've been able to parlay my passion of mountain climbing with a purpose of being an Alzheimer's advocate, to honor my mother Ida who died from Alzheimer's, and to use that to I think, have a life that I never ever dreamed of. And so, I am now at kind of kind of done, Allen 1.0, Athlon 2.0. And I'm now kind of in the design phase of Allen 3.0. And I think the catchphrase would be to give back, I have been given a gift and I feel a responsibility to be able to give back. And I you know, one of the ways is through the ongoing chronic calling of, you know, the high altitude climbs and trying to be transparent and authentic in my reporting, not to be sensationalized and just, you know, be respectful of everybody there, do my part to contribute to helping make these mountains a cleaner, safer place, to the extent that I have any ability to influence but I do my best, and then to, you know, to work with people, especially young people. You know, Tom, I am very concerned that climate change is changing the composition of all of these mountains. We're seeing it this year, I just got a message this morning that people on Gasherbrum to that it is just as much on the mountains, anchors are giving out they're rappelling and scared to death because they're afraid the anchor is gonna give out because it's so warm on the mountain. They just stopped climbing on Nanga Parbat for the same reason rain of 5000 meters which is unheard of at this time of year. You know, I is horrible as that is I see an opportunity. And that is for the younger generation, the ones that are probably 12 years old now, that when they're 20, not 38. They go to the same mountains that we've been celebrating and enjoying for centuries, or for at least decades, that they go and they pioneer new routes that are safer and more doable. Probably in our lifetime, the Western tomb and the Khumbu Icefall will become unclaimed Rubble, I'm pretty sure of that. But just because of, you know, the melting of the snow, the movement of the glacier, the size of the crevasses, so then Nepal is going to have to make a decision and the community will that is taking a helicopter into camp too. Is that still is that considered appropriate? I mean, they take a helicopter now into Basecamp and 50 years ago, you never would have done that, you know, 30 years ago, you would have done that. So maybe that's part of you know, An Inconvenient trend that we're gonna see things having to change to accommodate the world in which we live you know, I'm not going to sit here and say it's right or wrong but I will sit here and say that it's probably going to happen and then we're going to have to make a decision whether climbing in a style that was appropriate 50 years ago, which is today suicidal, you know, why would you go do that? Would you have an alternative? And so we'll see what happens

Thom Pollard:

right

Alan Arnette:

now this is now the third year in a row China is closed, declining and I'm hearing rumors that we're going to close it again next year keep it closed. So

Thom Pollard:

that's an interesting topic because when we mark Senate run on can I we say we lucked out we got there in 2019 and nobody's been back and all these people well, we should go search for Evans body over here. See if they could do the Norton cool wire route. Good luck. You might never get your shot. This might be generations away.

Alan Arnette:

Yeah, yeah. That's a different set of rules. I think it is. I love the whole marks book is back on my on my top here, and I love the book. I love your story. What you guys did and and I think you're looking for a ghost, though. I don't think I don't think the bones were there. So

Thom Pollard:

I think you're right. I think you're right. Well, as Mark said, we talked not that long ago when he met he got this tip that supposedly the The '60 team had seen Ervin and removed but then the body was removed some years later, he goes, gosh, if National Geographic had heard that story, before we left, they would have pulled the plug. I mean, that would have saved us a lot of problem, I suppose. But nobody wants the plug pulled on an expedition. So good information eased its way out

Alan Arnette:

and is such a great story and adventure history right up there with Shackleton, and, you know, all of the great polar explorations. And I mean, just, you know, did they did they die going up or down? And you know, and, you know, was did their oxygen systems work? And how did they manage to get that high? And and what happened? Where did they go? I just love it. I'm just, I'm just captivated by the mystery of it. And personally, I hope it's never solved. But I love I love the fact that we don't know, and that it gives everybody a chance to have a, you know, an opinion on it. And we can, you know, discuss it endlessly.

Thom Pollard:

Yeah, I agree. I think it's to have there be an unsolved mystery. And maybe it is the mystery of Mallory and Ervin that it's it's not unlike that idea of the mystery of life. Right? It keeps people dreaming, pursuing, coming up with ideas in their head, and it gives them some zest. And so I agree with you, I first of all, I don't think we're ever going to solve it. But that's not necessarily a bad thing. keeps people searching.

Alan Arnette:

Yeah, yeah. I always wanted to go climb on the north side, I went to the South Side four times. And in 2008, I was all set to go had my tickets, you know, everything ready. Then the Chinese closed the north side because of the Olympics. And they want us right of the torch up to the top. And so, you know, they paid the Paul$30 million to shut down. And you know, I've got a picture of a guy walking around with a rifle at the camp to on Everest, and part of the Nepali army. And they were there, they confiscated our satellite phones. It was repulsive. I mean, it was everything that you never want politically on a mountain. It had been so politicized. We were seeing Chinese fighter jets flying over the summit. It was and then they did a live broadcast of the team taking the torch to the summit. And they said, Okay, now you can call It was it was it was surreal. It was surreal. him.

Thom Pollard:

So that was on the south side at Camp two. So at 21,000 feet, there was a guy with an army guy with a machine gun,

Alan Arnette:

or with a long, I remember, they confiscated our satellite phones. And so we had to go put them into this blue barrel, you know, one of the poop barrels. And so if you wanted to use it, you had to go over and take your cell phone out, and then they were standing next to you and listen, and I became the ugly American. I was like, you know, I, you know, I was just really upset, just, you know, very frustrated at my wit's end. And so I'm, I'm talking and I looked this guy standing right there, just staring at me. I said, Here, do you want to talk to my wife, you are talking to my wife? And the guy was like, you know, I was kind of looking back at that. That was not one of my better moments. But

Thom Pollard:

yeah, you know, it's funny because I have a lot of people reach out to me and say, oh, there's no way the Chinese would ever have removed the body of Mallory or Irvin or anybody for that matter. And I say in 2008 they closed the mountain just to take debris and bodies off so there you go. i They

Alan Arnette:

you know, I think I've learned in my 65.9 years is never say never

Thom Pollard:

All right, I've taken up enough of your time, Alan, it's so always great to see you. Perhaps we will cross paths in Nam che bazar or wherever someday on a track into base camp.

Alan Arnette:

I will buy you a martini at one of the new bars in Namche next time we're there.

Thom Pollard:

Oh, I just have to order a double.

Alan Arnette:

It's no longer a beer now. It's just a martini. So

Thom Pollard:

I love that I actually I'm I'm I'm intrigued. Let's make it happen real soon.

Alan Arnette:

Okay, my friend. Hey, it was an honor having being here on your podcast. I appreciate you reaching out to me.

Thom Pollard:

Martinis in the Khumbu, times sure have changed. Alan, I will take you up on that. Looking forward to it. If you want to reach out to Alan Arnette you should check out his website blog and podcast on Alan R net.com. It is well worth your time. If you're interested in anything that's Everest or 8000 meter peak related. He is a Good man. He knows what he's talking about and he does his research. Check them out. You're gonna enjoy it. Thank you for being here. If you haven't already, please click subscribe. If you don't want to subscribe, no worries. Come back off and let me know about what you think about this video and the others. Peace out. Have a great day.